Olycka med ryska ubåten M-200 i november 1956

[Perman]

http://hem.bredband.net/hansfredriksson ... diski2.htm

Här är ett galleri med bilder på hur det ser ut i den f.d. sovjetiska örlogsbasen Paldiski i Estland idag. En av bilderna visar ett minnesmärke eller sjömansgrav över de 29 omkomna i olyckan med ubåt M-200 i november 1956. Nån som möjligen vet mer om omständigheterna i den här olyckan? Av vilken typ var M-200?

/Per

[varjag]

M-klassen (Malyutka) var en liten kustubåt varav de byggde massvis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_M_Class_Submarines

och här lite om kollisionen

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_M-200

[Perman]

M-klassen (Malyutka) var en liten kustubåt varav de byggde massvis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_M_Class_Submarines

och här lite om kollisionen

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_M-200

Tack varjag! Det var verkligen tragiska omständigheter. Ännu ett exempel på när byråkratin och befälssystemet inom den sovjetiska militären skördade liv i onödan. Konstigt att man inte hört om den här olyckan tidigare, men den har väl hemlighållts.

Men varjag - det verkar som om det finns motsägande uppgifter om vilken klass som M-200 tillhörde.

Från den eng wikipediasidan om olyckan:

М-200 Месть (Mest, meaning "vengeance" or "revenge") was a Project 615 (also known by the NATO reporting name of "Quebec"-class) short-range attack diesel submarine of the Soviet Navy.

Här är en babelfish översättning av en rysk sida om olyckan som det länkades till på den eng wikipediasidan om olyckan, och där det verkar som om M-200 tillhörde M V-klassen som byggdes 1943-47:

The diesel submarine M-200 "vengeance" OF THE XV series from the composition of 157-1 individual brigade of the submarines of Baltic fleet perished on 21 November, 1956, in The suurupskeye strait of Baltic sea as a result of collision with the destroyer "stately". M-200 accomplished passage from Paldiski to Tallin for the measurement of magnetic field and vice versa. Commander was the day before replaced on the boat - new became the captain of the 3rd rank Of shumanin, which served earlier on the boats of series "5" and "s", but not had the habits of control of "baby". By the ensuring officer was aboard located the chief of staff of brigade the captain 2- GO of rank it was bayonet. After the end of the measurements into of on 19.00 21 November M-200 it left back in Paldiski. In 19.45 the signalman of the watch revealed the fires of counter ship on the distance in 40 kabel'tovykh. Located on the bridge is bayonet, the destroyer correctly determined in the counter ship, was recommended Shumaninu to be more attentively with the divergence, after which it went down downward to supper. Despite the fact that the commander of the "stately" of three times money-changers course, departing to the right, Shumanin continued to follow by the head-on course, and on the distance into 4 hawsers, probably, after losing orientation relative to the maneuver of "stately", it returned the command to sharply turn to the left, "after substituting" boat under the impact of destroyer. 19 hours of 53 min "stately" it cut into the starboard M-200 in region 5-6 otsekov.Podvodnaya boat it became rapidly to settle stern, in the flow 6-10 min the trim difference reached 80 degrees, after which the boat swiftly sank. On the surface remained 8 seamen, two of whom soon sank. Those locating in 5 and 6 sections of six submariners perished at the moment of collision. On the bottom together with the boat remained 28 crew members, that are located into 1,3 and the 4th sections. In 20.00 according to the talinskoy naval base it was declared "battle alarm" and the ships of Eastern- Baltic flotilla began to leave into the region of emergency. Emergency buoy was discovered in 21.05 and connection with the 1st section was established; however, by this time seamen, find into 3 and by the 4th sections already perished. In the course of night with 21 on 22 November into the region of emergency left 16 rescue it was ship with two kranami.Pervonachal'nyy intentions of the commander OF VBF to bring under the housing of boat slings for towing in the shoal for the purpose of the conclusion of crew to the surface carried out could not be. They did not know how to also organize supply into the 1st section of air through the outboard valves. Still at night, into 04.00, submariners reported that they present rescue equipment and they prepared it cut off for the independent outcrop. However, instead of giving of "good", the gathering chiefs of all ranks started to confer, as a result of what the solution about the conclusion of personnel was accepted after almost the twenty-four hours from the moment of emergency - whereas into on 17.00 22 November, the boat it was planned to raise 250- ton crane, killektornogo vessel and rescue vessel "Pulkovo". The beginning of works was determined to 18.00; however, because of weather deterioration rescue vessels drifted and the telephone cable of emergency buoy was torn. Connection with the boat of prekratilas'.Vozobnovili the rescue operation of already on 23 November. In 03.47 gone down divers revealed boat, with the inspection of housing in the open upper hatch of the 1st section was discovered dead submariner, included in IDA. To save there was already nobody. The submariners remaining themselves in the section understood after the break of connection that to hope not on whom was made the decision to leave independently. However, after a prolonged stay in the cold water, under the conditions for the high concentration of carbon dioxide, seamen were first deprived of forces and Warrant Officer, entered the hatchway, it died of the heart insufficiency, after shutting with rest way to the rescuing. After the already six days M-200 it was raised by rescue vessel "commune" and it was towed away into Tallin. At the end of the investigation of the circumstances of the loss M-200 of shumanin and commander of the "stately", the captain 3rd rank Of savchuk, they obtained on three years of camps. The command of Baltic fleet, which led the most talentless in the history rescue operation and 36 it is hour the assumed solution about the conclusion to the surface of those remaining into the living seamen, it remained aside. The lives of 28 submariners became the price of human carelessness.

M-klassen byggdes under 30- och 40-talen i ca 130 exemplar, och varav den sista varianten M V-klassen byggdes i 30 ex mellan 1945 och 47. Quebec-klassen däremot byggdes mellan 1954 och 1958 och endast i ett 40-tal exemplar, detta pga den opålitliga och farliga dieselmotorn med slutet kretslopp samt utvecklingen av atomubåten. Från wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_class_submarine

Quebec-class submarines were fitted with two regular diesel engines and a third, closed-cycle diesel engine, which used liquid oxygen (LOX) to provide air-independent propulsion while the submarine was submerged. This system produced remarkable submerged speed and range, and greatly increased the risk of explosion or fire.

The M-256 was lost from this cause. Quebecs were referred to by their crews as "cigarette lighters" or "matchsticks."

Att döma av besättningsantalet på de olika klasserna och antalet omkomna vid olyckan så pekar det på att M-200 skulle ha varit av Quebec-klass (ca 30 besättningsmedlemmar, 29 omkomna). Den äldre M-klassen hade endast 18 man ombord. Jag har inte hittat några uppgifter på hur länge M V-klassen var i tjänst, men enligt Marinkalender 1958 så fanns ännu 47 st ubåtar kvar i tjänst av hela M-klassen vid den här tiden så troligen var samtliga ca 30 ubåtar av M V-klass fortfarande i tjänst i november 1956.

Vad jag förstår så måste jagaren Statnyj ha varit av den talrika Skoryj-klassen (som det tyvärr inte verkar finns någon nämnvärd info om på nätet):


/Per

[varjag]

Det är mycket möjligt att jag har fel...när jag läste M-200 mindes jag omedelbart de höga numren för de lilla M-klassbåtarna som ännu var i tjänst då. Håller med - 30 man på en 200/350-tonnare verkar otroligt....Varjag

[Urban]

I Boken Warships of the USSR and Rusia 1945-1995 så står det inget om att en M-200 av Quebec klassen ska ha sjunkit 1956 och dessutom så fanns det ingen Quebec aka Project 615 klass med beteckningen M-200, utan lägsta numret är M-254.

Flera olyckor skedde med dessa men endast en (M-256) sjönk med förlust av nästan hela sin besättning 1957 nära Tallin pga brand i diesel utrymmet. Frågan är dock om boken stämmer...

Vikten 250 tons kran som nämns i babelfish översättningen tyder även på att det kan röra sig om den äldre ubåtstypen men antalet döda på 29 st pekar ju på den nyare klasen som hade just 29 mans besättning.

[Stefan]

Men det står ju att 8 sjömän förblev på ytan, varav 2 dock drunknade snart. Så det är 29+6 ev 8.

Jag orkade inte läsa hela, dvs såg inte om någon räddades efteråt via räddningsaktion.

[varjag]

Enligt det vanligen välinformerade

http://uboat.net/allies/warships/class.html?ID=212

förefaller M-200 verkligen ha varit en liten M-klassbåt som jag först gissade.

Vad 30+ mannar gjorde ombord är gåtfullt. Babelfish-texten talar om 'magnetiska fält' vilken möjligen helt enkelt betyder kompassdeviering. Vilken utförs i ytläge (?).
Det gällde ju en mycket kort resa, Tallinn-Paldiski-Tallin - bara cirka 27 N.M. i vardera riktningen. Kanske dom hade 'elever' ombord som skulle lära sig devieringens hemligheter , Varjag